1) Will likely be a great, eye-opening documentary.
2) The DVD rip has been leaked all over the internet. See: thepiratebay.org

But yeah, still go out and see this thing.

I thought about making a thread about this, but meh, I didn't feel like it. When the hell has there been spellcheck? Wtf?

Yeah... I forgot what I was going to say. Oh yeah, I want to see this movie, however, having dial-up, I cannot download the rip. Damn. Dial-up screws me over once again.

It's about time that a big name has done something about the healthcare industry. Morgan Spurlock with Supersize Me was a beginning, and now Mike Moore takes up the fight.

However, I know that a lot of anti-Michael Moore enthusiasts will probably get all pissy and bitchy at him, but still, this shit needed to be said, even if it does come from Moore. Can't wait to see it, although I'm surprised at how direct he appears to be about lying to get what he wants. Which I suppose I can only say: More power to 'im. Corporations lie to us all the time. Why can't we get them back once in a while?



Man, I'm tired and I bet this doesn't make that much sense. Anyway:

Michael Moore, new film, he lies to get shit done, which I say it's been a long time a'comin' for corporations, and if it gets shit done, more power to him. I'd like to see it, but I'm too much of a lazy bastard to pay six bucks and/or wait four weeks to download the movie.

Maybe I'll find a bootleg copy.

When corporations lie, they get sued and lose a considerable amount of money. There are several governmental organizations that keep corporations in check, and effectively prevent them from lying.

When Michael Moore lies, he's being a total douche, creating two types of people: (a) those that realize he's lying, and who acknowledge that he is a douche, and (b) those that believe him.

I didn't mean that corporations flat-out lie. They merely suppress the truth and try to bury it in their backyards...

Sure, it's not LYING, but it's almost on the same level.

[quote="GoldenRhino"]
justify, source, etc. please.[/quote]

Are you the only person who refuses to believe that, particularly in reference to [i]Fahrenheit 9/11[/i], that Michael Moore's tactics rely heavily on misleading information, incorrectly drawn conclusions, false edits, fact-skewing, etc.? If so, then I must respect your opinion. However, I'm sure if you did a little research, you'd come to the same conclusion as I have, but I'd rather not do the work for you.

Not only this, but the man revels in cashing in on tragedy, with little to no respect at all.

And to Blank:

Corporations are the same as you or I: they can lie, cheat, steal, and swindle. However, just like most people, most corporations opt to play fairly. Just because a few people steal doesn't mean everyone does. Therefore, just because a few corporations lie, doesn't mean you can use such a blanket statement as that.

It's also far harder for a corporation to lie (especially more so today than ever) than it is for an individual to do any of the things I have listed. It's easy and likely for a corporation to get caught, because like I said, there are numerous governmental agencies and watchdog organizations who spend all their time effectively keeping businesses (particularly large ones) in check.

"Corporations" are not evil conglomerates that want to take over the world, or that want to make money off of killing you. This is a falsehood that somehow became popularized, but has little to no relevance at all (much like the senseless and offensive myth that all lawyers are somehow the scourge of the earth).

Mike Moore is going to be on the Daily Show tonight if anyone's interested.

In before "Michael Moore is right!" vs "Michael Moore is a liar!" Oh, wait.

I'll admit he certainly leads his audience in the direction he wants them to go, and he isn't trying to give an unbiased look at any given issue, but I still respect and like him because he sheds light on many of the issues that are important to me, and, what do you know? We tend to agree.

I don't like Micheal Moore because
1 he stretches the truth a lot...
2 He has this smug know-it-all quality in his narration. Like geez, didn't you know this you stupid moron? God... Americans sure are stupid, let's automatically assume we're talking to children

[quote="Jomei"]In before "Michael Moore is right!" vs "Michael Moore is a liar!" Oh, wait.

I'll admit he certainly leads his audience in the direction he wants them to go, and he isn't trying to give an unbiased look at any given issue, but I still respect and like him because he sheds light on many of the issues that are important to me, and, what do you know? We tend to agree.[/quote]

But when it comes down to it, it's just propaganda with no journalistic integrity at all. I don't know if he purports to uphold any standards of integrity, but if he did, he'd be wrong - and if he didn't, many people still view his works as valid, rather than the propaganda it is.

Anyway, my point: Propaganda doesn't become good if it's for a good cause.

I guess it depends how you define propoganda. Moore has a reward out for anyone who can find a false statement made in his films, IIRC. It's not journalism in the way we expect the nightly news to be, but perhaps you can consider it more like an opinion piece supported by evidence.

[quote="Jomei"]an opinion piece supported by evidence.[/quote]

Right.

Sheer, please check out Sicko. I'd really like to hear what you think is "wrong" with it and how we shouldn't take it seriously.

I can't properly criticize "Sicko" as I have not yet seen it. I was only referring to his former works. However, I will try to check it out, when I can, with an open mind. I'll try not to associate it with his former works. At least this time he isn't cashing in on other people's tragedies, and everyone else's fascination with them - so that's already a plus.

When you think of his works as "opinion pieces supported by evidence," then I suppose they are satisfactory. My only problem is when people view them as accurate documentaries, or valid sources, rather than one man's opinions in documentary form. It's unbelievable how many people will quote his works in a debate setting, without knowing where he got his information, or the context of the information - all they know is that he said it, so it must be face-value true. Of course he has evidence, but when real - even concrete - evidence and bias are mixed together, the result is unreliable and often misleading.

[quote="sheerheartattack"]I was only referring to his former works.

When you think of his works as "opinion pieces supported by evidence," then I suppose they are satisfactory. My only problem is when people view them as accurate documentaries, or valid sources, rather than one man's opinions in documentary form.[/quote]


What's wrong with The Big One?



Yeah, I know what you mean regarding the face-value truth aspect to a lot of what he says (I pretty much just ignored most of Fahrenheit 9/11 as anti-Bush propoganda, which it is), and its people like that who make me cringe at the thought that some people take everything that Stephen Colbert says while he's in character seriously.




ANYWAY THREAD, who has seen this film? I did take notice of the inclusion of Bush's "uniquely American" comment to that one chick who works three jobs in the preview... so should I expect a shiatload of anti-Bush rhetoric?

[quote="Blank"] that some people take everything that Stephen Colbert says while he's in character seriously.[/quote]

Actually, I think it's sort of funny, either he's mocking them and they remain clueless, or they don't understand he's joking.