Thanks for the suggestion! Alas, these are the little things that get glossed over in the interest of just Getting a Thing Done. I'm anticipating many more of those necessary oversights in Feb...all for a good cause!

And thanks for sharing Mariana - I especially liked your vocal tone. You do seem to have dialed back any "oversinging" (I'm not really sure what to call it, other than strong vibrato and a sense of justice/honor, that sort of "upstanding" and proper way of singing - you know what I mean?). Something that gets closer to your natural speaking voice, but is still very tuneful and pleasant to listen to. I hope to hear more of that soon.

It's funny, it looks like I came out with a similar song structure to what you did there: verse, verse, and a hint of a chorus. I think it's actually a great way to get 90% of the way there on an idea - gives us the feel, the hook, all the essentials, without needing to build it out to four minutes. It gets in and out effectively. I'll try to keep that in mind for the future.

What do your recording setups look like?

Here's my little area, in the corner of my apartment. My guitar stand broke, so I'm just putting these guys wherever nowadays. I should get a new one.

[img]http://i.imgur.com/Mkw5ZOa.png[/img]

[quote="GoldenRhino"]Thanks for the suggestion! Alas, these are the little things that get glossed over in the interest of just Getting a Thing Done.[/quote]
You can always go back to the song to flesh out more parts and fix the lyrics later on sometime.

[quote]nice things about muh singings[/quote]
Kyan~ senpai noticed me/thanks!

[quote]It's funny, it looks like I came out with a similar song structure to what you did there: verse, verse, and a hint of a chorus. I think it's actually a great way to get 90% of the way there on an idea - gives us the feel, the hook, all the essentials, without needing to build it out to four minutes. It gets in and out effectively. I'll try to keep that in mind for the future.[/quote]
I think I started writing songs way back using the VCVCBC kind of idea and variations thereof almost all the time, but ended up eventually enjoying slightly different ordering to the sections or more minimal structures like that one you wrote, etc. For example, Sentimental Girl's Violent Joke doesn't really have a ton of sections, it just uses good variations on the parts to get. shit. done.

I mean, sometimes you want a long windy song like Strange Chameleon, but there's this really intense pull to a shorter structure that sort of leaves you wanting somehow.

[quote="CARNVAL372"]

Btw I've recorded another [url=https://soundcloud.com/curtis-pea/from-somewhere-nearby]song[/url]. Here, I think I over did the [url=http://beatlessongwriting.blogspot.co.uk/2014/02/ticket-22-bluesify-your-melody.html]"flat note"[/url] singing thing on the word "how". But other than that, still tell me what you think about the song.[/quote]

From 0:36 to 0:42 in the song, i felt as though a nice palm muted strum pattern (for the lead guitar, or even the rhythm!) would have really complimented the song. Much better on the strumming and use of the other guitar.

[quote="GoldenRhino"]k guys, this isn't really a disclaimer as much as a "hey, this is neat": This is kinda the first tune i've written lyrics for and recorded, something that feels like enough of a "thing" that i could reasonably call it a "song" and show some people. I came up with a few ideas last night, lyrics today, figured out some basic piano this evening, and I just stepped out to my freezing car (THE VOCAL RECORDIN STUDIO) to record some singing. i'm feelin like a high five.

oh warning, i'm a sap

[url]https://soundcloud.com/lasercruster/robin[/url][/quote]

whoa, nice song man. Bring on more sap! Really like the vocal "roominess" you had going; felt like I was watching/hearing in an auditorium. Look forward to the full song man.

Makes me want to try piano again....

[quote="GoldenRhino"]k guys, this isn't really a disclaimer as much as a "hey, this is neat": This is kinda the first tune i've written lyrics for and recorded, something that feels like enough of a "thing" that i could reasonably call it a "song" and show some people. I came up with a few ideas last night, lyrics today, figured out some basic piano this evening, and I just stepped out to my freezing car (THE VOCAL RECORDIN STUDIO) to record some singing. i'm feelin like a high five.

oh warning, i'm a sap

[url]https://soundcloud.com/lasercruster/robin[/url]
[/quote]

I liked how you start the song off an Anacrusis, wasn't really expecting that! I also liked how much you packed in such a short song, nicely done. I also liked the two chords you used at the end of the verse. The lyrics are also nice and I liked the imagery. Also, piano is a great instrument to write songs with!

[quote="Dewith"]
From 0:36 to 0:42 in the song, i felt as though a nice palm muted strum pattern (for the lead guitar, or even the rhythm!) would have really complimented the song. Much better on the strumming and use of the other guitar. [/quote]

Palm muting doesn't sound right for me on acoustic though, but thanks for the suggestion! I do however wished the bridge had a better chord progression but nevertheless, I like it the way it is.

I have another song I written many moons ago, recorded last night. [url]https://soundcloud.com/curtis-pea/i-saw-a-witch[/url]

For this song I wanted to simplified everything about this song, I also wanted to take a break doing out of key songs that I usually do.
I did a few Melisma moments with this one but I felt it was necessary to the song, especially hanging on the 4th (A) of the Em chord at the "Flowers" part. As usual with my songs, this song blasts you straight to the verse, and I also end the song on a ringing chord. I added a few bars to other sections of the song because I didn't had enough breathing room to sing the next parts of the song. I didn't give all the melody to the vocals as well. I shared them with the lead guitar parts. For the outro, I fashioned the chord progression from previous chords in the verse and bridge. I didn't start the song on the root chord (C), and I never used the IV and V anywhere in this song. I also ended the song on the Am (vi) chord instead of the C (I) chord, aka the Aeolian cadence! Also this song is in AABA with the title appearing in the first line of the lyrics.

As for the lyrics in this song, I used several lyrical pairings:

Until she gave some/Until she escape some
At a tower/At a house
She had flowers/She even had flowers/ She even gave some/Until she gave some

And lastly, there's only 22 words in it!

Expect for my FAWM songs to come soon!

not only am i a sap, i'm also a total cornball.
Started with chords on this first, then melody...and lyrics dead last. haha. ha....
Thematically similar to the last song, and I promise I'm not making a concept album.

[color=#008000][url]https://soundcloud.com/gpwaltz/bear[/url][/color]

FAWM is upon us!! (So is late bedtime, jesus christ this is going to be an unhealthy month)

[quote="CARNVAL372"]

Palm muting doesn't sound right for me on acoustic though, but thanks for the suggestion! I do however wished the bridge had a better chord progression but nevertheless, I like it the way it is.

I have another song I written many moons ago, recorded last night. [url]https://soundcloud.com/curtis-pea/i-saw-a-witch[/url]

Expect for my FAWM songs to come soon![/quote]

I hear what you mean about the palm muting...

Nice man; liking the second little guitar, as always, in the new song.

Looking forward to the FAWM songs.


[quote="GoldenRhino"]not only am i a sap, i'm also a total cornball.
Started with chords on this first, then melody...and lyrics dead last. haha. ha....
Thematically similar to the last song, and I promise I'm not making a concept album.

[color=#008000][url]https://soundcloud.com/lasercruster/bear[/url][/color]

FAWM is upon us!! (So is late bedtime, jesus christ this is going to be an unhealthy month)[/quote]

ahhhhhhh, this song is soothing, rewarding, and some other uplifting adjective. Really dig the radio usage! You have quite the exceptional voice GR.



On another note, I finished up a few songs that I have been working on. Would love some feedback!

https://augustlives.bandcamp.com/album/honeysuckle

[quote="GoldenRhino"][color=#008000][url]https://soundcloud.com/gpwaltz/bear[/url][/color][/quote]
Cool radio clip usage, as was said; was expecting you to sing some lines over the top of that, actually.
Your singing was a lot better on this track overall, much more confident. The only thing that I could suggest is that sometimes "e" sounds (like in "whatever") can get a little wide-sounding compared to your fantastic delivery on vowels like in "shoes." Feel free to disregard if you're doing it as a stylistic choice, but you can make that resonate a bit better by making it more of an "ah" or "ay" sound, depending on your preference - an "eh" or "uh" sound can be done clearly but you have to project it up into the sinuses a little bit more to get the same smooth resonance, while cheating slightly sounds the same to listeners while being easier sounds to sing clearly (especially "ah").

[quote="Dewith"]https://augustlives.bandcamp.com/album/honeysuckle[/quote]
Dawg. Have you been listening to some Sorority Noise or anything? "Get" has some really cool vocal layering that reminds me of them a bit. Neat song.
I felt at times as though some of your backing layers could have been a bit more dynamic in "Drag" (some decrescendos and crescendos to the electronic layers to enhance/highlight sections more would have made it a more enjoyable listen for me), but I really like the arrangements overall as well as the variety of writing/production. I really like Wasp a lot (definitely my favorite of the bunch), and Eye in the Tree was quite nice too.

[quote="CARNVAL372"][url]https://soundcloud.com/curtis-pea/i-saw-a-witch[/url][/quote]
I like your singing on this one a lot more than most of the previous tracks, particularly the phrase from 0:17-0:21. I'm a big fan of melodic purty singing, having done choir for years, so I'm semi biased against certain sorts of dissonance (and T-pain vocal effects lol).

[quote="Marekenshin"][quote="GoldenRhino"][color=#008000][url]https://soundcloud.com/gpwaltz/bear[/url][/color][/quote]
Cool radio clip usage, as was said; was expecting you to sing some lines over the top of that, actually.

[quote="Dewith"]https://augustlives.bandcamp.com/album/honeysuckle[/quote]
Dawg. Have you been listening to some Sorority Noise or anything? "Get" has some really cool vocal layering that reminds me of them a bit. Neat song.
I felt at times as though some of your backing layers could have been a bit more dynamic in "Drag" (some decrescendos and crescendos to the electronic layers to enhance/highlight sections more would have made it a more enjoyable listen for me), but I really like the arrangements overall as well as the variety of writing/production. I really like Wasp a lot (definitely my favorite of the bunch), and Eye in the Tree was quite nice too.

[/quote]

Same thought about the singing over the radio. Mark Linkous did some singing over a phone message he'd recieved from his mother; he used it in the song Spirit Ditch, I believe. In contrast, Elliott Smith did the same thing you did GR. With or without the singing over, I really enjoyed the song!

I haven't hear of Sorority Noise; any suggestions of their songs or albums?

I didn't know what exactly to do with that song Drag when it came to singing it; i'll have to put a little more in the back-up vocals, surely it'll add something more.

I thought Wasp was a little "heavy" for my usually style, but I have been trying to branch out a little. I did another song called Crypt that incorporated a little more distortion and what not. I'd like to do a split of an album including distortion and acoustic songs.

Again, thanks for the feedback. For some reason, I can count on the people here more than my own friends when it comes to giving feedback and knowledge! You guys rock

Fellow musicians/songwriters tend to be more receptive to talking shop about these kinds of things in my experience, for sure haha.
On Drag, I actually thought the vocals were fine and the arrangement itself was great - it's just that the electronic layers seemed to have a fairly static dynamic for much of the song compared to the other tracks. But seeing as Brand New is one of my favorite bands, I'll always encourage people to add more vocal layers haha. Wouldn't mind hearing any reworks you do of finished pieces sometime, if you end up going back and changing anything.

This is Sorority Noise's latest single: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSk8kY_rcrk
But here's a song they did that I think is more along the lines of some of the things you recorded there: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4l1EgOfMB4

[quote="Marekenshin"]
On Drag, I actually thought the vocals were fine and the arrangement itself was great - it's just that the electronic layers seemed to have a fairly static dynamic for much of the song compared to the other tracks. But seeing as Brand New is one of my favorite bands, I'll always encourage people to add more vocal layers haha. Wouldn't mind hearing any reworks you do of finished pieces sometime, if you end up going back and changing anything.

This is Sorority Noise's latest single: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSk8kY_rcrk
But here's a song they did that I think is more along the lines of some of the things you recorded there: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4l1EgOfMB4[/quote]

When I was doing the midi layering for Drag, I tried to make the background electronics lower in order to keep focus on the vocals; I didn't want the electronics overpowering, but in reality, they could have been a bit more dynamic (rehearing it now). It's difficult to decipher, for me at least, if an instrument is overpowering or just underlying impact status. I get so in tuned with specifics of the song that I forget about the song as a whole; that's something I need to work on in order to make the song bloom i guess.

That song you sent, When I see You, is pretty bad ass. Definitely enjoyed that bit. Really liked how it picked up at the end!

Their latest single is pretty descent. I like the lead vocals more then the higher backing.

I feel as though their earlier stuff I would enjoy more; that is, if it's like that song you shared (When I See You).

I'd recommend the album "Joy, Departed" without any reservations - solid from front to back. Hope you like it!

Wrote another new song tonight, and once again lazily recorded it as just a reference take on acoustic.
https://soundcloud.com/midnight-down/hello

[quote="Marekenshin"]I'd recommend the album "Joy, Departed" without any reservations - solid from front to back. Hope you like it!

Wrote another new song tonight, and once again lazily recorded it as just a reference take on acoustic.
https://soundcloud.com/midnight-down/hello[/quote]

I'll have to check it out sometime this week.

Listened to your song; the chord progressions, along with the pick up/slow down, was really nice to hear. You tend to sing with deeper vocals, which is great. There was a point in my music making where I had to choose between singing in a deeper or higher voice and I obviously picked the one I was more comfortable with. Back to you, even if it was a "lazy recording," I really enjoyed how your voice compliments the chords your play.

Here's the link to my first fawm song: [url]http://fawm.org/songs/67734/[/url]

Constructive criticism appraised and welcomed.

[quote="Dewith"]https://augustlives.bandcamp.com/album/honeysuckle[/quote]

I liked "Drag" the most because it starts off the vocals early on and keeps the listener engaged for the duration. But I also liked the chords here you used as well. Kind of gives me of George Harrison vibe here. Also it's the only track with the least dissonance notes in it. I also liked how you turned down the excessive repeats that I have pointed out on the last EP, nice job! I also liked the descending chromatic counter melody in "Sundowner". You also have nice guitar tone throughout your songs.

Now for the downside of this EP, I still think the intros are way too long, they don't quite engage me enough to listen to the songs for long. I was really getting annoyed when the vocals were going to come for "Sundowner" for example. I understand you're trying to set a vibe for the songs, and that's cool. But there needs to be balance of setting the mood but yet keeping the listener engaged throughout the song as well. And like I mentioned before you can recycle previous parts of the song and set that as the intro to the song. Not only this will keep the listener engaged but it will also make that part more memorable. This is considered a modified intro and you can read more on it here [url]http://beatlessongwriting.blogspot.co.uk/2014/02/ticket-4-recycle-your-os.html[/url] It's also explained in the current Beatles Songwriting Academy podcast, BTW have you gotten to listen to it by any chance? This will give you nice ideas on how to make intros more captivating. Aside from that, I feel like there's a bit too much dissonance in the synths. I'm not sure if it's a stylistic choice but if it is, then disregard my advice on it. But if it isn't, I suggest to use less dissonant notes next time. I feel like the chords you use provide that dissonance enough. So just start the dissonance with the chords and see where it goes.

[quote="Markenshin"]Wrote another new song tonight, and once again lazily recorded it as just a reference take on acoustic.
https://soundcloud.com/midnight-down/hello[/quote]

Another solid song you have written. And I feel like the intro sort of serves a purpose. But I feel as though you can improve it a bit more by setting lyrics to it (just about 4 lines or less) or include a spoken word part. The pre-chorus? ( "You give all you have left
afraid you might lose the bet") chord progression is fine but I think it would have been surprising and more effective to end the progression on a secondary dominant rather than a dominant. The Beatles and the pillows used them in various of their songs.
Your singing is really good, and as you stated before you were in a choir class and this definitely proves it! The chorus and the outro reminded me of how Skeleton Liar was structured, really cool. ;y I also like the imagery of the lyrics that has to do with the flowers and such! I think you should join FAWM, you'll get tremendous amount of helpful feedback on there, and there are fun challenges to try out! Don't worry about writing 14 songs, that's not necessary! Just have fun!!

[quote="Dewith"]You tend to sing with deeper vocals, which is great. There was a point in my music making where I had to choose between singing in a deeper or higher voice and I obviously picked the one I was more comfortable with.[/quote]
Your singing kind of reminds me of something like...the Flaming Lips or something, sometimes? Not sure exactly which band(s) I'm thinking of. I think your "ideal" range in terms of vocal chord resonance may be just a few steps lower than most of your songs are (if you like, maybe try writing in a key 1 or 2 notes down from songs like Eye in the Tree and Keeping it to Myself; or alternatively tossing a capo on and writing in the same key, but up about 6 or 8 frets sometime and see how that feels on your voice!), but your tone is nice overall.

[quote="CARNVAL"] The pre-chorus chord progression is fine but I think it would have been surprising and more effective to end the progression on a secondary dominant rather than a dominant. The Beatles and the pillows used them in various of their songs.[/quote]
Oh, hey, thanks for reminding me about how to use 7 chords to change keys (I had to look up what a secondary dominant was lols) by bringing those up! I'll think about using one in another song, and I'm pretty sure there are a handful (2ish?) songs I've written that do use them, but for this one I think just a plain ol' V is great because of the way the next phrase launches straight into a snappy upbeat progression leading off the I. That section is really just a little decoration/contrast to the fun "can't/can/can't" stuff right after before it launches back into the main hook again.

[quote]The chorus and the outro reminded me of how Skeleton Liar was structured, really cool. ;y I also like the imagery of the lyrics that has to do with the flowers and such![/quote]
Thanks to both of those! I'm not actually sure what I'd consider the various sections on this song, as it's really got a structure liken ABAA' or maybe ABCABA', if you think the little "so far from home" is it's own part rather than the tail of the main section. The Skeleton Liar similarity was unintentional, as I was going for more of a Robert Pollard with a chord progression/rhythm I had used for an intro in an old song, but putting it into that key made it really obvious where I pulled that from subconciously, huh? The flower motif was a purposeful nod towards Sawao and his love of using them in imagery.

Anyway, I gave your FAWM song a listen - the vocals are once again cleaner and your intended notes are much clearer. I feel there are a few spots where you stay on the same note for the vocal melody longer than I would have chosen to, but I think it kind of gave me something of a classical vibe. Maybe that was the chord progression? Anyway, it's not my style of music, but I do think you're improving as a vocalist, and the crisp guitar strumming was solid.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and I'll maybe consider looking at this FAWM thing another year, but having such narrow interests, I'm not really that into such a broad-interest group. I'm trying to be a little more forward-thinking about how I go about building up my skills and musicianship, and I am down with feedback and talking shop with fellow musicians, but I'm also content with the smaller network I have already that I engage with at my own pace.