It's a pretty fun thought, that our perception may or may not be true. But I'm not trying to question anyone's perception of existence. Music has always been an artistic expression, it's just the canvas is an instrument and the paints are the notes and sounds that they produce. Now, if that's been commercialized, that's not my fault. Art in general has been commercialized. I think we can agree that my music is definitely not accessible to a majority of people. Not because I aimed for that. I aimed to make a song based on a pattern I really liked. I happen to like distortion and feedback, and it happened to be part of the pattern. I didn't expect you guys to like it, but I didn't really expect this big of a fuss. Like I said, it's not as if I'm the first to do this kind of music. Japan has perhaps the biggest noise movement, including the boredoms and quite a lot of other bands that have crossed the seas. It's no big deal. Music is art, whether aimed at a large audience or not. I didn't cater it to your ears. Big deal. It's just a song you guys don't like. Big deal. It doesn't have a discernible melody. Big deal.

Play the music you like.

[quote="Kyoko"]Okay, that first point, what the fuck. Yes, I understand that there are chemical reactions in the brain that cause these sensations, but don't you dare pretend to act like anyone can understand why it feels a certain way to be alive.

And don't you go whining about how I can't control my bitchyness tonight, or I'll have you answer to my falling estrogen and progesterone levels triggering the lining of my uterus to shed.

Music is an art. Your last point is ridiculous. Televisions are not sodas. Music is art. Televisions are not sodas. Music is art. And are you trying to say it's not music but it's art, so it's a bunch of sounds coming together to form art? Which, uh sounds like it's describing uhhhhm MUSIC MAYBE?!

Editing to include quote!!!! "What surrounds us we endure better for giving it a name--and moving on. But to embrace a thing by defnition, is to reject that thing, to render it insiipid and superfolous, to annihilate it."[/quote]

You can't just make up a definition of something because you feel like it. Music is not merely a "bunch of sounds coming together to form art." That's ridiculous. You can't just lump every aural form of art together and call it music. Music is more specific and deserves more respect than that. It would just be like combining photography, painting, and sketching, and saying it's all "photography." It's not. Your quote, by the way, makes no sense at all. At all. Neither in wording, or principle.

My last sentences were ridiculous to point out how ridiculous you're being. It's the exact same damn thing. Televisions are not sodas because we have a clear and distinct definition of a soda. It's not stupid or ridiculous to define things. It [i]makes sense[/i]. "Noise music" is not music because it is not consistent with the definition of music. "Noise music" [i]may[/i] be art because it is consistent with the definition of art. It's a simple concept.

Finally, why is it so unreasonable to you to think that someone can understand why something feels a certain way? Ignorance does not make something nonexistant.

[b]To Clouds:[/b]

I'm not saying what you did is not art. I am saying that I didn't like it, but for my own personal preferences, and mine alone. I am saying that it does not conform to the definition of music. However, it could very well be a legitimate form of art. Then again, what isn't?

[quote="Kyoko"]my falling estrogen and progesterone levels triggering the lining of my uterus to shed.[/quote]

Ah yes, I believe it was the great Paris Hilton who once said: "That's hot."

Here's the end to this dispute:

::some people think music and art are all about the content.
::other people think music and art are all about intent.

Alright, how many internets did I just win there?

sheer wins. I am the authority on these matters.

[quote="GoldenRhino"][quote="Kyoko"]my falling estrogen and progesterone levels triggering the lining of my uterus to shed.[/quote]

Ah yes, I believe it was the great Paris Hilton who once said: "That's hot."

Here's the end to this dispute:

::some people think music and art are all about the content.
::other people think music and art are all about intent.

Alright, how many internets did I just win there?[/quote]

Two.

Sheer, what separates music and art?

Music is a leaf on the tree of art. C'mon!

[quote="sheerheartattack"] "Noise music" is not music because it is not consistent with the definition of music. "Noise music" [i]may[/i] be art because it is consistent with the definition of art.[/quote]

Artful noise = music. Oh, and would you please define music for us, so we all finally know what -is- music?

[quote="clouds"]Sheer, what separates music and art?[/quote]

Apples and oranges.

Art is the creation or expression of anything humans find aesthetically pleasing. Like Kyoko mentioned, it plays on our emotions and sensations.

Music is a specific, often artistic, expression in the form of rhythm, melody, and harmony.

Edit: Music is not necessarily artistic. That is why "artful noise" is not inherently music. Otherwise, music would merely be "noise."

Yeah 2 dizzid

[quote="GoldenRhino"]Alright, how many internets did I just win there?[/quote]

No internets, but few coupons for free 12-inch Quiznos subs are in the mail. If you don't like Quiznos, send it my way. Bare Mother Hubbard's Cupboard is baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaare.

Haven't read the argument, don't really intend to, either.

[quote="sheerheartattack"][quote="clouds"]Sheer, what separates music and art?[/quote]

Apples and oranges.

Art is the creation or expression of anything humans find aesthetically pleasing. Like Kyoko mentioned, it plays on our emotions and sensations.

Music is a specific, often artistic, expression in the form of rhythm, melody, and harmony.

Edit: Music is not necessarily artistic. That is why "artful noise" is not inherently music. Otherwise, music would merely be "noise."[/quote]

don't forget dissonance. That is a big musical concept that came in to play from the 60s and is still very popular today.

lol sonic youth lol number girl lol pernderecki lol etc.

[quote="sheerheartattack"][quote="clouds"]Sheer, what separates music and art?[/quote]

Apples and oranges.

Art is [b]anything humans find aesthetically pleasing.[/b]


Edit: Music is not necessarily artistic. That is why "artful noise" is not inherently music. Otherwise, music would merely be "noise."[/quote]

Wait. Explain how any piece of music is not enjoyable to at least SOME person. Then explain why noise that is aesthetically pleasing isn't music.



Sorry, sheer, but you're looking like a major douche.

You guys are way too quick to give out art awards. Sure, anything created has artistic [i]qualities[/i], but to call anything created art? Fuck that. BioDome is not art. Justine Timberlake is not an artist (nor is the person that actually writes his music). These are not contestable. They are facts. I haven't listened to clouds' song, and I don't intend to. 'noise' anything -- music or otherwise -- does not interest me. That said, if the song is an exceptional example of the genre that it belongs to, it may be considered art. Is it music? Who cares. Right?